UPDATE by quirke 06-15-08
The accused shop, Ulljasbeads.etsy.com, is no longer active on Etsy.
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UEN has received an outline from Etsy seller Abeadisborn detailing an apparent case of fraud on Etsy, alleging that another Etsy seller has been purchasing and re-selling lampwork beads from other artists under the claim that she had made the beads herself. The following information has been published with permission of the author.
On April 19th, 2008, I received an email from a fellow glass-bead maker on Ebay. She had asked if I was aware of someone purchasing my handmade lampwork beads through Ebay, and selling them in her own Etsy store, claiming to have made the beads herself. I was quite shocked, and had to investigate further. This link: http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=200215772276&category=34070 shows my Ebay auction, won by the alleged IP offender, gerbera28, aka Ullja/Melek Kuntze. By request, I made this auction available as a “buy it now” for the customer, because she said she was in need of the beads very quickly. The beads were mailed to: Melek Kuntze [address removed], with a delivery confirmation of 9101 7850 9140 1537 7553 85, which were delivered to the home at 5:24 PM on April 22, 2008 in [location removed].
After investigating further, I found this indeed was true. This link: http://www.etsy.com/view_transaction.php?transaction_id=8440928 is the link to the altered by Etsy sale information, of my beads. Sold by Ullja Kuntze, gerbera28. The attachment with this email is the original sold information page, screen printed, BEFORE Etsy made alterations to the description. Also attached, is the PDF file of the documents I faxed to Etsy, on May 27th 2008, pertaining to this matter.
After contacting other fellow lampworkers about this occurance, many beadmakers like myself, found evidence of this happening to them as well. It became a very big issue, and more complaints were sent to Etsy.
I followed Etsy’s Intellectual Property Right claim guidelines, by faxing them all the pertinent information pointing to this Etsy seller, and provided them with the proof, showing her fraudulent activity on Etsy. Etsy’s attorney, Sarah Feingold, called me to confirm that she had gotten the fax information, and the matter was being looked into. Shortly after, I noticed about 72 sale listings at Ulljasbeads.etsy.com, disappeared. Those listings were of the same nature as mine. They were handmade lampwork beads, made by people other than her, and she knew she was caught. I have a PDF file of all Ulljas Etsy listing pages, before they were removed. If you need them, please let me know so I can send you a copy.
To date, Ulljasbeads.etsy.com is still an active selling member of Etsy. She is still advertising other people’s handmade lampwork beads on her website, located at http://yhst-59139618684516.stores.yahoo.net/ - if you follow this link, the blue encased floral bead featured on her front page, is still being displayed, whos copyright belongs to someone other than her, who has also filed an IPC complaint on her.
In case the screenshot linked to is unclear, the text that was removed from the sold listing reads “All my beads are made by me in my private glass studio in Milan Italy… kiln annealed overnight for durabilityand strenght and Dremel cleaned for you”.
The listing that Abeadisborn refers to as being altered by Etsy may be one of the listings that Etsy has admitted to altering (see our previous coverage here).
From Etsy’s Copyright Policy:
B. Once Proper Bona Fide Infringement Notification is Received by the Designated Agent, it is Etsy’s policy:
1. To remove or disable access to the material infringing upon the intellectual property;
2. To notify the user that Etsy has removed or disabled access to the material; and
3. That repeat offenders will have their infringing material removed from the system and that Etsy will terminate such users’ access to the service.
June 15th, 2008 at 3:04 am
I’m playing Devil’s Advocate here. In light of the terminations/reinstatements of sellers, including ArtfulMarket, perhaps Etsy is taking more time before closing accounts or otherwise meting punishment? Not that that explains deleting a seller’s explicit representation in a reported sold listing, without even a notation that anything had been edited.
I’ve read only a fraction of what’s posted on the LE forum and am amazed at the number of artists coming forward there. I wonder if this is “the first” time this sort of issue has been raised on Etsy. Remember how long it took for the whole R thing? I also caught up on one of the earlier (?) threads and was shocked at some of the other Etsy user’s posts. It still (I know, dumb me) shocks me to see people tell other sellers they are not wanted on the site, for posting on a forum thread. And it seems to be the same cluster of people, every time some poo like this goes down, as happened when the other sellers got closed/reopened, apologies issued.
btw - I have no inside knowledge or anything. I’ve not been keeping up on the fora much except for goofiness and didn’t read any of the threads until today. I’m trying to make sense of things and am not doing a very good job at it.
June 15th, 2008 at 2:28 am
I don’t think it’s sales. ArtfulMarket got shut down over one non-delivery report and she had 15,000 sales.
I would guess it’s disorganization, bad or no training, not hiring people with the proper experience, the left hand not knowing what the right is doing, and all of that leading to perpetual inconsistency.
It’s either that, or Etsy thinks one non-delivery report is a far more heinous crime than willful and repeated fraud.
June 15th, 2008 at 12:59 am
quirke Says:
June 13th, 2008 at 11:24 pm
“I don’t understand why sellers who commit proven fraud more than once are permitted to continue to sell on Etsy, while sellers with excellent reputations and no history of trouble are shut down without warning over a single non-delivery report.”
As others have said…… SALES. Even if 227 isn’t that much it is still huge compared to most and every little bit counts. Or, is she friends or related to someone at Etsy? We all know how Etsy works. There are plenty of people out there in Etsy land who are getting special privileges because of who they know. Whatever the reason. It should be quite apparent to everyone by now that Etsy only follows Etsy’s rules when they feel like it. There is no rhyme or reason to it. What’s new! I have come to accept it and that is why I don’t do much business on the site anymore.
June 14th, 2008 at 10:40 pm
I have been a victim of copying on etsy, too. I filed a DMCA to etsy several times and the other seller’s listings were removed. Even with multiple offenses multiple times, the other seller is still allowed to sell. Now she has even copied the look and feel of my entire shop. From the forums/blogs that the other seller has participated in, I think she is a favorite among the etsy staff, fo I guess there must be a gray area for those who kiss up to etsy. I am trying to look for another venue to sell at since they can’t even follow their own rules. Independent art must be protected and it isn’t protected on etsy, so I will have to go elsewhere, I guess.
June 14th, 2008 at 9:49 pm
Thanks so much for breaking this news, UEN This is precisely why I follow this blog — I get the story no one tells at Etsy. I had seem references to an issue about beads, but wasn’t on the inside and didn’t have enough information to follow things.
This is really serious stuff, and Etsy needs to act on it. Editing a sold listing in this case (and not booting the seller) makes them seem complicit in the ongoing fraud.
June 14th, 2008 at 7:52 pm
glasstastic, I use dawanda- they are smaller, but growing bigger by the day, and the site actually functions well. Also, they kicked this same seller off their site immediately once evidence was brought to them.
June 14th, 2008 at 1:53 pm
haha, Jamn, you’re right. I think I was just blinded by the average of 227 sales/month.
I calculated at each being a $20 sale, that it is only about $158. Maybe the activity to the site helps etsy earn money too. I have no idea. Just grasping at straws, and that was all I could come up with.
Also, I don’t think etsy is concerned with too many people leaving. Where are we going to go? I have no other options that I’ve been able to find. And I will not go back to ebay.
Maybe I need to so some more research…..hmmm
June 14th, 2008 at 1:31 pm
Seriously 227 sales is not that much money. A lot of those auctions were $9.99. I am not sure what the gross was but it couldn’t be that much $.
I am puzzled why they would upset so many sellers to save one? It stinks.
Thank-you Etsynews for getting the word out! You guys ROCK!!
There are so many lampwork artists that were involved its unreal.
June 14th, 2008 at 1:24 pm
I’m really coming into this late. I found the thread in lampworketc.
My thoughts are that etsy did not shut ullja’s bead shop down because of her sales. She’s averaging over 227 sales per month. Why would they want to lose that money? Dawanda shut her down most likely because she was a new shop there.
Since everything else has seem unethical on Etsy’s part, I’m surprised they didn’t close her down and tell her to just start a new shop.
June 14th, 2008 at 10:11 am
I think the fact that this happened and was discovered does not surprise me at all…there will always be people trying to make a fast buck off the backs of others. But the way Etsy is handling the situation downright baffles me. The only reason I can “reckon” as to why they keep shops up that people repeatedly protest are practicing shady business is because those particular shops are just too profitable for Etsy to let go of without a fight. Ethical? of course not. Profitable? yes, in the short term, but that seems to be the nature of how most decisions are made there.