Seller ArtfulMarket is the latest shop to be shut down under confusing circumstances, according to this forum thread started by ArtfulMarket using another account. ArtfulMarket is one of Etsy’s most successful sellers, with close to 15,000 positive feedbacks, and who makes regular appearances on EtsyTools top sellers lists. At the time of this article’s publication, the ArtfulMarket shop is the “brick wall” indicating a closed account.
lynn61056 says:
I just wanted to let everyone know that I am trying to find out why my shop is gone. I have tried to contact Etsy about it and they sent me an abuse report from a customer who says they never received their order. Funny thing is I can’t find any record of the order in my PayPal account. So it appears they may have shut me down over an order that was never paid for. To all of my loyal customers I will continue to get all of your orders out from the invoices in my PayPal account until I can get this resolved. I am in shock that Etsy would shut me down considering I have almost 15,000 positive feedback. It appears there has been a BIG misunderstanding. I have sent several more emails to Etsy and have not received any response. Please be patient…I am still around!
Please note that Etsy’s version of this incident is not currently available, and ArtfulMarket’s post cannot be verified by UEN at this time.
edit by JB February 25
artfulmarket’s Etsy shop has been reinstated
As well, earlier today, seller Whatyoumacallits reported on the forum (via another account) that her shop had also been closed without warning. Their shop has since been reinstated. Whatyoumacallits has over 140 positive feedbacks and no negatives.
Edit:
A THIRD shop has been reported as closed without prior notice: Thatsmycharm, according to this thread posted by the sellers’s girlfriend (who is a top seller herself). As of February 11th, Thatsmycharm had over 1300 positive feedbacks and no negatives.
Thatsmycharm’s shop was reinstated on Saturday.
According to a statement by admin Kfarrell in this thread, this is Etsy’s notification process:
kfarrell says:
Transaction report emails go out automatically whenever a customer files a nondelivery report. The seller receives an email to let them know a report has been filed, and the buyer receives an email advising them to contact the seller directly. The emails do not assign blame to either party.If you get a notice of a nondelivery report filed against you, contact both the buyer and support ASAP with any information on when you mailed the package, how it was shipped, where it was shipped from, etc.
for previous coverage of this issue of shop closures without warning, please see these previous articles:
http://etsynews.com/584/two-seller-accounts-deleted-under-strange-cicrumstances/
http://etsynews.com/73/unwarrantedaccidental-shop-suspensions-sellers-be-warned/
http://etsynews.com/75/another-case-of-erroneous-shop-suspension/
http://etsynews.com/80/how-does-admin-handle-shop-suspensions/
http://etsynews.com/312/etsy-says-no-double-billing-has-occurred/?cp=5
(see comments, not main article)
Edit by Serena 2/22 1:30 ET:
Etsy admin daniellexo recommends the following steps to ward off surprise account closure:
1) Please make sure your email addresses are correct on file. If this address isn’t correct - we can’t contact you and neither can buyers.
2) Add support [!at] etsy.com, abuse [!at] etsy.com and billing [!at] etsy.com to your address book. This way it will not be forwarded to your spam/junk mailbox.
3) Keeping open lines of communication with Admin. We will try to contact you numerous times.
Source: Fora.
February 26th, 2008 at 8:41 pm
handed out flyers at my son’s school
oh my gosh I can’t even imagine the embarassment when the other moms saw that brick wall. That’s not some anonymous internet person those are people you have to see in person every day. This is so wrong. Etsy, you did wrong, you harmed people. Please make this right.
February 26th, 2008 at 8:37 pm
JB: exactly, its not just an oopsie daisy, I’m sorry situation tat can be swept under the carpet!
I do not know how many sales I have lost over this past weekend due to this error, all I can tell you is that the hours prior to my shop closure were spent marketing and promoting a sale I had set up for the weekend. I had reworked and uploaded my webpage with the sale details, advertised the sale on Facebook and Squidoo, rewritten my shop announcement on Etsy, handed out flyers at my son’s school and spent hours promoting the sale on the forums. I then went to bed knowing that I had done all that I could to market my shop for the weekend sale only to wake up in the morning to find that my shop had been closed soon after I had shut down my computer. Even though my shop was re-opened for the remainder of the weekend, the damage had already been done, no one knows how many people would have visited my shop only to find the brick-wall error message while it was closed, and my ability to try and save the weekend by promoting in the forums had been muted for both of my shops.
February 26th, 2008 at 8:31 pm
my2pennies that is a really good point. I was in the chatrooms last night and you know how it’s polite to post some items from the shops of the other chatters in the room?
I checked the shops of several people looking for items to post and was really surprised to see no items for sale, 0 feedback which indicates no purchases either, and these people had been members for 2 years and are regulars in the chatrooms and forums and frequently curate treasuries. There were MULTIPLE people fitting that description. I guess they either buy privately, or are planning to list items someday, or maybe they just joined for the community aspect of Etsy, but why would Etsy automaticaly assume some malicious motive?
An account is not a sockpuppet if it’s your only account.
Etsy has been trying to turn the site into a social networking site instead of a commerce site, so they cannot be so suspicious of people who participate in the community and not in the commerce. Unless someone has broken a rule, leave them be!
February 26th, 2008 at 8:24 pm
Um, no. It’s not OK. You can reopen it but harm has been done o an innocent party. That is not OK.
There is a mark against the shop in the public opinion. Etsy has damaged that shop’s good name and the mark cannot be erased by just reopening the shop and saying “Oopsie!”
February 26th, 2008 at 8:16 pm
that storque article contains the same lies that have been touted in the fora in recent days…Etsy does NOT communicate, that much is clear. And they close down the BUYER’s account for items not received and closed cases at that! As well as mistaking a buyer’s request for help as an “item not received” complaint.
What a bunch of bullshit. My dad used to pull that same thing “no I’m not doing anything bad - it’s your fault for thinking I would do anything bad” It’s abuse at any level
February 26th, 2008 at 8:15 pm
JB: may I add a #20 & #21 to your list?
20. Just because a member of long standing doesn’t show any purchases or sales does not necessarily make them a “sock puppet.” Can we please get rid of that childish name altogether?
(Is an opinion only valid if money has been spent on Etsy? Can my opinion only be expressed if I’m willing to risk my shop’s existence since it’s evident they will mute anyone for one perceived “disrespectful” comment?
How do they really know if a “sock puppet” is, in fact, a disgruntled member—perhaps they’re actually the spouse of a big-volume seller with a vested interest or someone who is about to open a shop and they are just testing the waters?
The presumption to know motives of individuals is arrogant and irresponsible.)
21. If Etsy makes a monumental mistake by closing a shop, will they publicly apologize in an attempt to salvage a shop’s reputation?
This is insanity. I don’t even feel comfortable posting under my shop name because Etsy admin will read this & make my life more difficult.
February 26th, 2008 at 8:10 pm
It’s not a bad article, but in the final analysis the information in it is meaningless. The use of qualifiers (”generally”, “we try to”, “usually”) makes it pretty worthless as a policy and procedures document.
This one gets me:
What if the Buyer filed a Non-delivery complain by mistake, or the Seller never got these emails, or the Buyer never let the Seller know that there was a problem?
It’s OK. We can re-open your account. We can close a case. There will be no mark against you or your account.
****
Notice how they don’t say “What if Etsy closes my ship in error?” No, it’s all the Buyer’s or Seller’s fault. And the “It’s OK, we can re-open your account” business is risible. No mention of restitution for lost business, of course. No apology from Etsy. No acknowledgment that their error has affected your ability to make a living.
February 26th, 2008 at 8:02 pm
Why isn’t this information posted in Etsy’s FAQs?
We try to respect the privacy of those going through Non-delivery cases. When a Buyer files a Non-delivery case, both parties are informed of the policies and process via email.
Call me stupid but how does this FAQ violate a buyers or sellers privacy?
February 26th, 2008 at 7:57 pm
A new Storque article addressing the issue of shop closure
Dear Buyers & Sellers,
There has been concern in the community for the past couple of days regarding Non-delivery complaints and how they are handled by Customer Support. I have created a FAQ list below (feel free to post more questions in the comments below). I would love to hear from both Sellers and Buyers about what you think Etsy should do about Non-deliveries, and in what ways the Support Team can improve communication with our members when there is a concern. We are going to be making some changes over the next year to the system, and maybe even our policy. We are toying with some big ideas, and we’d like our community to weigh in!
What is the purpose of Etsy’s Non-Delivery complaint system?
-To put the Seller and Buyer in touch with each other so that they work out the problem
-To protect Buyers from deadbeat Sellers
-To prevent a misunderstanding from resulting in negative feedbacks and loss of money
-Because Etsy wants to help
Why does a Buyer file a Non-delivery complaint?
- Buyer has placed an Etsy order and paid for it
BUT
- Buyer has not received goods at promised delivery date
- Buyer has Convoed and emailed the seller, but has not gotten a response
What happens when a Buyer contacts a seller with a Notification a Non-Delivery?
- The Seller gets their first Notification of Non-Delivery on the same day the Buyer files it. As of December 2007, this is a guarantee.
- The Buyer gets further instructions to do the following: Contact PayPal, email and Convo the Seller, and update Etsy with changes to the case.
What does Etsy say to the Seller?
- Etsy asks the Seller to contact the Buyer to work out the problem (we will close our involvement in the case when a Seller is working with the Buyer)
- Etsy asks the Seller to provide proof of shipping to us and the Buyer so that we can close the case
- Etsy includes information about our policy regarding proof of shipping and how to close a case
- Etsy asks that the Seller get back to us so that we know that her account is active
- Each case is dealt with on a case by case basis
How many Notifications does a Seller get?
At least 3 and up to 6.
How long does Etsy wait to hear from a Seller or get a reply to our emails to Sellers?
Every case is different, but generally we keep sending emails for about 30 days.
Why would Etsy ban a Seller in a Non-Delivery case?
If after the process described above,
- Seller has not refunded a transaction as promised
- Seller has not delivered goods as promised
- Seller has not responded to our emails
- Buyer has reported that there is no update on the transaction problem
- Seller does not work with the Buyer to create a solution
When does a Seller get banned?
We try to wait at least 24 hours before closing an account after we have sent the Suspension Notice as a last ditch hope that a Seller will respond. This Suspension Notice usually arrives least a month after the Buyer has filed the complaint.
If a Seller does not have proof of shipping, will they get banned?
Generally, a Seller who is in touch with Etsy and their customer will not get banned. Naturally, a Seller must prove that they sent the product, but every case on Etsy is different. We understand that not every Seller gets proof of shipping, and we are happy to help work out a problem. Each situation is looked at case by case.
What if the Buyer filed a Non-delivery complain by mistake, or the Seller never got these emails, or the Buyer never let the Seller know that there was a problem?
It’s OK. We can re-open your account. We can close a case. There will be no mark against you or your account. There are a lot of transactions on Etsy, and sometimes there is confusion about how to report something. Not everybody checks emails, and some people have spam filters.
Can Etsy prove that they sent Notification Emails regarding Non-delivery?
Yes. Contact abuse@etsy.com to get the emails and dates on which they were sent.
What happens to the Buyer when a case is closed?
The Buyer may be able to get a refund through a PayPal claim. Etsy will close the Seller’s account, and offer some information and resources to where they can get help next. Local authorities can help, as well as FBI cybercrime, where a victim of a money loss can file a report. The Buyer may also file a complaint with the Better Business Bureau. Etsy is not affiliated or working with these public organizations.
What happens in most Non-delivery cases?
Overwhelmingly, most cases are solved instantly. Our Notifications help with a miscommunication problem, and every case is reviewed individually. Very few cases ever end in a closure, and amongst that group, we feel very strongly that these Sellers do not belong on Etsy. While still rare, there are Sellers on Etsy who have taken money from Buyers without delivering goods. We want to keep it that way in the greater interest of the marketplace and community.
Why isn’t this information posted in Etsy’s FAQs?
We try to respect the privacy of those going through Non-delivery cases. When a Buyer files a Non-delivery case, both parties are informed of the policies and process via email. The Do’s and Don’ts of Etsy are being refined right now, so we should see additions like this when they are re-launched.
What is Etsy doing to make this a more fool proof system?
- We are building a reporting system that will allow Sellers to be notified in ways other than email.
- The new reporting system will allow the Buyer and Seller to update their own case.
- We are improving the checkout system.
- We are improving ways to teach new members about Etsy culture and how to be open to Etsy business communication.
February 26th, 2008 at 7:52 pm
Okay! well its another day here in sunny Perth, I have woken up and the good news is that my shop is still standing. But…. I am still muted under both shop IDs, I received an email from Ms DX herself, responding to my email regarding my forum ban, she is so clever, she just copied and pasted my original restraining order from last November!
There is no email replying to the concerns of my shop closure though, and still no explanation why Dabanajdesigns is still muted! They can see its not a sock puppet, it has stock, feedback and sales….
One thing that I was thinking to myself last night though is this..
As my shop was closed because I was a BUYER with a non-delivery complaint, what would of happened if that was all I was, a BUYER, could they have actually shut down a buyers account by mistake in this instance, and what would that buyer think if they tried to log on to Etsy and find that they didnt exist! and if that buyer even did bother to come back and find out what had happened, what would the plebs have been saying in the forums if a BUYER was complaining about Etsy shutting down there account for no reason…. With the shoe on the other foot, the sellers would start worrying about how many of their buyers could be lost due to these colossal mistakes! You can bet that instead of throwing slanderous misinterpretations of what a seller has done to be closed down, that instead there would be a lot of sucking up to said BUYER!!