Today Etsynews has learned of two successful Etsy shops that were deleted under seemingly strange circumstances. This is complete account deletion- the shop is a brick wall. It’s not the same as being muted in the forums. Etsy has warned users with bills over 3 months overdue that their shops will be deleted, but neither of these cases seems to be related to overdue bills. Both sellers have received emails from Etsy which state the reasons for their stores being closed, and they are not bill-related.
All of the information we have about these two cases comes from the sellers. Bear in mind that there are two sides to every story, but Etsy will never discuss the cases in public so we will never hear both sides. Certain facts can be verified using google’s cached pages and posts in public forums.
The first deletion we learned of was Thaidreams.
This is a cached page of her shop on January 12, 2008.
As of January 12, she had 100% positive feedback and had made 466 sales.
She wrote about Etsy closing her shop in her blog here, and she posted the email that Etsy sent her in her blog here.
The reason allegedly given was “a history of conflicts”.
The second deleted shop is still trying to get reinstated, so I cannot publish the shop name.
(update, January 22: Closedshop has posted her full story on page 14 of the comments on this article, and has revealed her shops to be heyprettycupcake and thepromoshop)
They did create a second account “closedshop” to post in the forums about their situation, and Etsy has since deleted that account as well. They (originally) did not publicly reveal their main shop name and UEN will not reveal it either, but I have verified by cached google pages that the shop had 100% positive feedback on January 16, two days ago.
This is their forum post.
They have multiple posts in the thread giving their version of events.
Other sellers in that thread (aorta, automaton, magicjelly) described having similar treatment from Etsy. (shops closed without warning for one lost package)
aorta says:
youstink, a buyer never got something so they filed a report to etsy. i never found out till my shop was closed- brick wall. i talked to admin who explained they send out 3 emails before they close a shop, but i never got those emails so i was shut down.
the admin i talked to did quickly reinstate my shop though.
magicjelly says:
Haven’t read the whole thread yet, but just wanted to add that this exact same thing happened to me last year - a former feature seller with 100% positive feedback, just like Aorta.I phoned NY & my shop was immediately reinstated. I was assured it was human error & that steps would be taken that this kind of thing wouldn’t happen again.
Both closedshop’s buyer and magicjelly’s buyer were told by Etsy to file cybercrime reports with the FBI.
The thread was locked with this admonishment:
RobWhite says:
We can’t discuss specific situations between Etsy admin and members of the Etsy community.For clarification, sellers who have bills that are 2 months overview will not be able to list, relist or renew items in their shops. Sellers who have bills that are 3 months overdue may be suspended. You can find that information in the Storque here: http://www.etsy.com/storque/section/etsyNews/article/billing-alert-a-reminder-about-the-new-policy-for-the-new-ye/858/ , which is also referenced in the most recent post about overdue bills here: http://www.etsy.com/storque/section/etsyNews/article/cant-post-new-listings-overdue-etsy-bill/1038/
We also ask that you do not make alternate accounts on Etsy for the sole purpose of posting in the Forums and/or chat rooms. The best and most expedient way to handle this situation is to contact Abuse at abuse (!at) etsy dot com.
Robwhite later in another thread explained he posted the overdue bill information to answer some general questions from the thread, but NOT to imply that the OP had been deleted for having overdue bills. (which would be a violation of their privacy if that was the case and he had discussed it in public)
previous UEN coverage of shop/account deletions
http://etsynews.com/73/unwarrantedaccidental-shop-suspensions-sellers-be-warned/
http://etsynews.com/75/another-case-of-erroneous-shop-suspension/
http://etsynews.com/80/how-does-admin-handle-shop-suspensions/
http://etsynews.com/312/etsy-says-no-double-billing-has-occurred/?cp=5
(see comments, not main article)
other users who have had shops deleted without warning, although most have been eventually reinstated:
moxierings
walkonthemoon
ScrapScrap
magicjelly
aorta/automaton
retroattic
thepromoshop
heyprettycupcake
Lesliejewelry
update, January 22:
Closedshop has posted her full story here:
Please note again, that this is the seller’s version of events, and UEN does not guarantee the accuracy of comments.
http://etsynews.com/?p=584&cp=14#comments
She has revealed her shop names: heyprettycupcake and thepromoshop. (both accounts are deleted/closed)
Etsy will not be reinstating either shop.
Update January 31:
another case of sudden shop closure: Lesliejewelry
http://www.etsy.com/forums_thread.php?thread_id=5444820
That shop has been reopened
January 24th, 2008 at 4:17 pm
“I saw the negative feedback left on your store through google cache and many of them seemed to point out that throughout the time you were away, you were still making purchases on etsy. That seemed to antagonize a lot of them.. Was your foster sister buying things through your etsy account?”
The last thing I bought on that Etsy account was some cufflinks (for an order) which was way before the day that I even closed down the shop. I don’t know why people are saying that I was making purchases because I WASN’T.
“additionally, while i can only read the first page of feedback through cache it appears that much of the feedback was being left for item purchased in October and earlier in some cases. I gotta tell you, even with delays in shipment, stuff from before you moved should have been shipped and done by Dec.”
I made custom promotional items. A lot of the time, when my customers order from me, they don’t have ready artwork. Some buy things in a sale and will get them to me when they get a chance. I have a girl who ordered from me when I FIRST opened up the shop (june-july) who hadn’t even gotten their artwork to me. A few days before I left, I printed up EVERYTHING in my inbox and worked on orders, my huband, my foster sister and I stayed up until 4AM getting orders done. I have a huuuuuuge receipt of items that I sent out before I left, dated 12-13-07, 24 packages shipped out.
January 24th, 2008 at 3:59 pm
Thanks for adding your story, SamJoe!
that illustrates how indeed, with the current Etsy system, an unscrupulous seller or psycho buyer could destroy anyone’s business by just claiming they never received the package.
This is also the sort of thing that indicates clearly, policy and experience wise, Etsy is nowhere near being able to properly take the role of a payment processor like Paypal.
January 24th, 2008 at 3:10 pm
I’m new to this debate but after all that’s happened I thought I might chime in. I opened an Etsy shop in April of last year and until Nov. I had an excellent experience, was selling insanely well, and had 100% positive feedback. I had some personal issues to tend to and had a slew of orders that needed to leave soon and since everything I sold was made to order, I emailed all customers expecting packages and everything seemed to be okay. I abandoned my computer for a week to work on taking care of my business and last I knew things were settled between myself and my buyers. I came back to the computer and my shop had been closed. Turns out a buyer who had bought from me weeks before this had left some awfully negative feedback and another had jumped on that bandwagon. The first buyer (we’ll call her/him Buyer One) was telling admin. that they had never received their package and had already filed a claim with Paypal. I checked my tracking info for the package and it had in fact been delivered…a month earlier, on time and without problems. This cleared up the issue with Paypal but Buyer One was still pushing Etsy and they refused to reinstate my store until I had either re-shipped or refunded. Since the items I should were pricey (in the $30-40 range) I opted to reship, again with tracking info. That info again confirmed that Buyer One had received their goods…but again they said they didn’t and Etsy kept my shop closed because I refused to refund money for the transaction. Keep in mind the tracking info I had was more than enough to close a Paypal claim. The second buyer I mentioned had simply not realized that there would be a two week lag before shipment and once that fact was laid out she retracted her claim…
I’m not really sure what the deal is with heyprettycupcake’s store but I thought I’d sorta detail my issue so that others could be aware. While I was on Etsy I visited UEN often, but after the removal of my store I stopped popping in here and now I wish I hadn’t. My issues with my customers were taken care of promptly and everyone that had bought from me was made aware of the situation but Etsy took the side of a buyer who was clearly scamming and as a result I lost my livelihood right before the Christmas season. I wish now that I had persued getting my shop reinstated but at the time I didn’t know how to go against the powers that be and though I was devastated and upset I felt there was really nothing I could do.
It’s just hard for me to buy those taglines and explanations from Etsy when I know my situation and how unfair admin was to me in dealing with the issues surrounding my situation…
January 24th, 2008 at 11:25 am
DantesSpirit Says:
January 24th, 2008 at 12:58 am
“I’m going to have to disagree here.
92% is NOT bad. It’s still in the upper percentage.
Now if it was below 75%, I’d raise an eyebrow. ”
On eBay I have always read that you should not buy from someone who has below 98′5%. If you read the forums over there that seems to be the common recommendation that is given. I usually keep that in mind when buying online.
January 24th, 2008 at 11:10 am
I agree that the way that Etsy did this was not good. I do wonder if perhaps Etsy attempted to email this seller but got no response. I’m simply not sure I believe that she got one email about one incident and then suddenly her store was closed. I also don’t think that it is Etsy’s intention to help people take other people’s money (which is what occured here, intentionally or otherwise) and (fair perception or not) it appears that the seller is making it right in response to being removed.
Having recently been through this exact situation with another seller, I can tell you that from a buyer’s perspective this all gets very dicey. I doubt very many people *intend* to get in this situation.
January 24th, 2008 at 10:33 am
bizatch, I didn’t know whether to laugh or cry at that thread.
Foot-in-mouth is so Classic Etsy. But, boy, is it painful to watch.
Just another example of Etsy’s overly laid-back management style - they don’t even require their staff to know the rules! Also an example of their favorite double standard: Etsy admins can make mistakes and be human; Etsy members must toe the line or else. And it’s hard to toe the line when the line keeps getting moved around.
And, on the subject of questionable shop closures, whatever happened to the goal of helping people ‘make a living making things’? I guess that’s just a cute catch phrase, not to be taken literally. Andy is right on the mark with this comment:
I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again:
No. Consistency. Whatsoever.
January 24th, 2008 at 10:20 am
additionally, while i can only read the first page of feedback through cache it appears that much of the feedback was being left for item purchased in October and earlier in some cases. I gotta tell you, even with delays in shipment, stuff from before you moved should have been shipped and done by Dec.
I’m not trying to be mean, but i don’t feel like you’ve been entirely candid here. I’m perfectly willing to call etsy on their mistakes, but this doesn’t appear to be one.
January 24th, 2008 at 9:59 am
closedshop:
I saw the negative feedback left on your store through google cache and many of them seemed to point out that throughout the time you were away, you were still making purchases on etsy. That seemed to antagonize a lot of them.. Was your foster sister buying things through your etsy account?
January 24th, 2008 at 6:27 am
As I said in the other comments, they have a Random Punishment Generator. It’s just not as pretty as the Bannerator so they keep it down in the basement.
January 24th, 2008 at 6:17 am
that pretty much describes every email from “Emily” that I’ve received.
I don’t think she reads the questions either, and the answers seem to be determined by some random program like a virtual “magic 8 ball”.
outlook not so good
Better not tell you now
Reply hazy, try again
Perhaps you should have told Emily
“It’s so common, that it really never occurred to me that this was a problem. ”
I hear that’s the get out of jail free card this week.