Today Etsynews has learned of two successful Etsy shops that were deleted under seemingly strange circumstances. This is complete account deletion- the shop is a brick wall. It’s not the same as being muted in the forums. Etsy has warned users with bills over 3 months overdue that their shops will be deleted, but neither of these cases seems to be related to overdue bills. Both sellers have received emails from Etsy which state the reasons for their stores being closed, and they are not bill-related.
All of the information we have about these two cases comes from the sellers. Bear in mind that there are two sides to every story, but Etsy will never discuss the cases in public so we will never hear both sides. Certain facts can be verified using google’s cached pages and posts in public forums.
The first deletion we learned of was Thaidreams.
This is a cached page of her shop on January 12, 2008.
As of January 12, she had 100% positive feedback and had made 466 sales.
She wrote about Etsy closing her shop in her blog here, and she posted the email that Etsy sent her in her blog here.
The reason allegedly given was “a history of conflicts”.
The second deleted shop is still trying to get reinstated, so I cannot publish the shop name.
(update, January 22: Closedshop has posted her full story on page 14 of the comments on this article, and has revealed her shops to be heyprettycupcake and thepromoshop)
They did create a second account “closedshop” to post in the forums about their situation, and Etsy has since deleted that account as well. They (originally) did not publicly reveal their main shop name and UEN will not reveal it either, but I have verified by cached google pages that the shop had 100% positive feedback on January 16, two days ago.
This is their forum post.
They have multiple posts in the thread giving their version of events.
Other sellers in that thread (aorta, automaton, magicjelly) described having similar treatment from Etsy. (shops closed without warning for one lost package)
aorta says:
youstink, a buyer never got something so they filed a report to etsy. i never found out till my shop was closed- brick wall. i talked to admin who explained they send out 3 emails before they close a shop, but i never got those emails so i was shut down.
the admin i talked to did quickly reinstate my shop though.
magicjelly says:
Haven’t read the whole thread yet, but just wanted to add that this exact same thing happened to me last year - a former feature seller with 100% positive feedback, just like Aorta.I phoned NY & my shop was immediately reinstated. I was assured it was human error & that steps would be taken that this kind of thing wouldn’t happen again.
Both closedshop’s buyer and magicjelly’s buyer were told by Etsy to file cybercrime reports with the FBI.
The thread was locked with this admonishment:
RobWhite says:
We can’t discuss specific situations between Etsy admin and members of the Etsy community.For clarification, sellers who have bills that are 2 months overview will not be able to list, relist or renew items in their shops. Sellers who have bills that are 3 months overdue may be suspended. You can find that information in the Storque here: http://www.etsy.com/storque/section/etsyNews/article/billing-alert-a-reminder-about-the-new-policy-for-the-new-ye/858/ , which is also referenced in the most recent post about overdue bills here: http://www.etsy.com/storque/section/etsyNews/article/cant-post-new-listings-overdue-etsy-bill/1038/
We also ask that you do not make alternate accounts on Etsy for the sole purpose of posting in the Forums and/or chat rooms. The best and most expedient way to handle this situation is to contact Abuse at abuse (!at) etsy dot com.
Robwhite later in another thread explained he posted the overdue bill information to answer some general questions from the thread, but NOT to imply that the OP had been deleted for having overdue bills. (which would be a violation of their privacy if that was the case and he had discussed it in public)
previous UEN coverage of shop/account deletions
http://etsynews.com/73/unwarrantedaccidental-shop-suspensions-sellers-be-warned/
http://etsynews.com/75/another-case-of-erroneous-shop-suspension/
http://etsynews.com/80/how-does-admin-handle-shop-suspensions/
http://etsynews.com/312/etsy-says-no-double-billing-has-occurred/?cp=5
(see comments, not main article)
other users who have had shops deleted without warning, although most have been eventually reinstated:
moxierings
walkonthemoon
ScrapScrap
magicjelly
aorta/automaton
retroattic
thepromoshop
heyprettycupcake
Lesliejewelry
update, January 22:
Closedshop has posted her full story here:
Please note again, that this is the seller’s version of events, and UEN does not guarantee the accuracy of comments.
http://etsynews.com/?p=584&cp=14#comments
She has revealed her shop names: heyprettycupcake and thepromoshop. (both accounts are deleted/closed)
Etsy will not be reinstating either shop.
Update January 31:
another case of sudden shop closure: Lesliejewelry
http://www.etsy.com/forums_thread.php?thread_id=5444820
That shop has been reopened
January 23rd, 2008 at 4:15 am
I’m in complete agreement Thai. I setup a small bigcartel shop yesterday :)
I’m always looking for alternatives to Etsy - I can’t justify the effort there anymore since they can rip my investment out from under me at any time.
January 23rd, 2008 at 4:14 am
I just looked into big cartel and it seems as though you can only have 5 listings for the free account and 100 listings is $20.00.
I don’t mind paying that, but I have over 500 items and it wouldn’t be that useful to me..
I am going to look into ecrater. I signed up for dwanda, it seems a bit confusing to me but I just need to sit down and figure it out!
January 23rd, 2008 at 4:03 am
AliciaMae, what you are saying is also why I think bigcartel might be a good option. it looks easy to start up a shop (it’s getting RAVE reviews all over the internet, I did some research yesterday) and it’s fully integrated with PayPal which is cool. You’re also correct about ecrater, we did like ecrater for set up, it was easy, but then only a few sales in approx 8 months of being there and on their forums many other sellers complain of the same thing. Dont know why either, because our things ended up almost at top of google search soon after we listed them on ecrater. Weird huh?
Also Dawanda is great right now, especially for closedshop, because there are NO listing fees, so if she starts up over there she’s not spending any money up front and it sounds like that could be one of her problems right now?
January 23rd, 2008 at 3:33 am
Thai, I have also noticed the lack of traffic on ecrater, but if one is looking to build an easy website with a shopping cart and payment integration and plan on promoting anyway I figure it’s a good option. I agree though that my main point is not so much that venue being great but that there are options :)
It’s extremely unfortunate that Etsy can not stick to its policies or its own goals and directive. The site mission is clearly undercut by closing down shops that have fallen on hard times or are the subject of attacks. There is no longer a “human” side to Etsy as long as they ignore the human faces of their sellers. Once again they forget who pays their bills.
January 23rd, 2008 at 3:32 am
And if you’d like a list of the people we had to report to Etsy over 10 months time for attacking our shop in the forums, you can email me privately and I’ll give it to you.
It consists of 8 Americans, 1 French woman who lives in America., and 1 Australian Like I said, most were Americans. So no, I’m not attacking Americans simply stating the truth about the people who harassed us. These people are also the same people who have harassed other sellers. I have emails and copies of convos from at least 6 other sellers who have experienced the same treatment from them (one left a message about it on our blog today). Yet all of those sellers are still selling on Etsy, and most of the 6 who were harassed have been either kicked off or left. Now that’s sad :(
January 23rd, 2008 at 3:27 am
Pearl, I’m done here. You are twisting my words. I have NOT kept putting down Americans. Poompat said that’s what i did in the forums. I did NOT. I said most of the sellers who were attacking us were American. They WERE. This to me, having lived there, was a good indication why so many people think we are resellers because they are Americans who have never left the country, so know nothing about my culture or Thailand. Again, not ATTACKING - the truth. 85% of Americans don’t even hold passports, so no, I’m not surprised if they don’t know anything about Thailand and think we are resellers.
why is it that every freakin’ time anybody says anything negative about America, we’re all of a sudden attacking America? What, it’s such a wonderful country it’s 100% perfect, so nothing is wrong with it? I lived there long enough and there are many things wrong with it. Many things right with it too, but it’s not perfect and neither are Americans.
Like I said, done here.
You keep your opinion about me, I’ll keep my own opinion. But I will tell you this, I lived in America for most of my life and the one thing that drove me nuts about it was so many people couldn’t take criticism of their own country.
Sure you can criticize Thailand, it’s not perfect. and neither are Thais. But we’re not so stupid that we get all offended and freaked out if somebody said “the people who attacked me were Thai”. If they WERE Thai, then they would be telling the truth. Why is that so difficult to understand?
January 23rd, 2008 at 3:26 am
In the case of forum disputes, I think there’s actually more than two sides. If two people are fighting in public, they will each have their subjective opinions on it, of course. But the community at large can also form opinions as witnesses. And regardless of any opinions, the actual posts still exist in their objective reality. (except for one thread calling out Thaidreams that was totally deleted the day before she got kicked off)
I am basing my judgments on what I have seen with my own eyes, not on either side’s portrayal of their own side. And neither side is 100% innocent. But the sides are not being treated equally, and that is my beef with Etsy.
January 23rd, 2008 at 3:14 am
I know that the UEN has requested all further posts to be about losing an account on etsy, but I’d like to address one more comment to Thaidreams’ situation.
Thaidreams,
The UEN has graciously allowed you to tell your whole side of this situation, and to make replies back to others who have opinions about certain things. In other words, they are providing a voice for you, a mouth, but you keep insisting on sticking your foot in your mouth.
It’s getting pretty hard to feel any empathy for you, when you blast anyone who disagrees with you. Kind of like you have done previously on the forums. The acusation of you getting into a lot of conflict with others is starting to make sense now.
I think you would really help yourself if you stopped putting down Americans. That would be a good place to start.
Also there are always two sides to every story. We have only heard your side. So expect some people to question what happened.
Thank you.
January 23rd, 2008 at 3:05 am
I wish they would give her a second chance too, but it seems like once they make a mistake, they can’t back down and reverse it, they just dig their heels in and stop listening. Yes, Vanessa did have a bad patch and did leave some customers in a lurch, but prior to these real-life crises, she had excellent feedback and many happy customers. She’d always been a responsible seller before. It seems obvious to me that she’s not a hardened criminal or a “bad seed” out to scam anyone. Isn’t someone’s entire history worth anything?
And I’ve also moved and it took over a month to get my dsl activated.
January 23rd, 2008 at 2:47 am
Let’s keep to the issues at hand, folks. No personal attacks please.
This is not about whether someone is a reseller or who said what to who on the forums, it is about Etsy policy and how it is enforced (or not).